Talents

Below is a list of benefits of different talents in Mythic+ as well as general choices that apply to most if not all dungeons. In general, we do not change our talents based on affixes.

Level 15

Zeal is the best all-around choice.

Level 25

Empyrean Power is the best all-around choice.

Level 30

Fist of Justice is the safe all-around choice.

  • Fist of Justice: has great all around use as stuns are always useful and this provides us more frequent access to Hammer of Justice.
  • Repentance: can be used as a backup Crowd Control if needed.
  • Blinding Light: is also all around beneficial and works as an AoE interrupt. Can also stop uninterruptible casts as it is a disorient.

Level 35

Unbreakable Spirit is the best all-around choice.

  • Unbreakable Spirit: cooldown reduction on our defensive is very strong given the length of Mythic+ runs and high damage sections.
  • Cavalier: can be beneficial if you find you need more mobility.
  • Eye for an Eye: niche usage. Physical damage is mostly avoidable or severe enough to warrant Divine Shield.

Level 40

Divine Purpose is the most versatile. Seraphim can pull ahead with proper usage especially if you're Kyrian.

  • Divine Purpose: is an easy to use and very effective talent.
  • Holy Avenger: will be hard to use in a Dungeon environment and a lot of value can be wasted by holding it for too long. Even when executed perfectly it would not come out on top.
  • Seraphim: can be difficult to get maximum benefit.

Level 45

Selfless Healer and Healing Hands are both viable choices.

Level 50

Sanctified Wrath is the safest all-around choice. Final Reckoning can be competitive.

  • Sanctified Wrath: can have use once Shadowlands launches. Not useful in Pre-Patch.
  • Crusade: not competitive.
  • Final Reckoning: can be competitive. For effective usage you want to make sure it does not fall out of sync with Avenging Wrath.

Trinkets

There are a wide variety of trinkets available for use to use. In most cases you will end up having 1 On-Use Trinket that lines up with Sanctified Wrath and then either a passive trinket or an On-Use damage trinket. More information is provided below.

Please review the AoE Trinket Ratings Chart on the main guide for additional trinket choices and as always make sure to sim your own character.

Simming Mythic+

Currently DungeonSlice is the best overall option that we have for simming as a Ret Paladin. You will frequently see other Class Discords say to avoid DungeonSlice. And that advice is true for those specific classes. They tend to have a lot more conditions based on numbers of nearby targets in their rotations. DungeonSlice is a bit more Single Target and small pack orientated. This causes the SimC to not fully represent the larger pulls that can occur and provide a substantial increase in damage or gear selection. Ret has the benefit of not being overly complicated. All we care about is if there is 2 targets which allows us to cast Divine Storm.

HecticAddCleave is the other sim that you will see commonly used. It is much more AoE focused. HecticAddCleave has its own set of problems, however. Even though it is more AoE focused you are always attacking a Main target with 5 adds frequently spawning. This causes Damage over Time, Bleed effects, and stat procs to end up overvalued. They will almost always apply to your primary target and not the adds that are dying off. In a Mythic+ environment these effects will frequently be applied to low health mobs that die before the effect had a significant duration, and with stat procs they could occur at the end of a pack and be wasted getting to the next one.

DungeonSlice helps to address these concerns. It starts off with you fighting a single Boss which then goes invulnerable. Invulnerable targets will not be attacked in the sim. Then at different intervals small add groups will spawn. There can be downtime between these packs and all the normal Bleeds, DoTs, and procs will occur. In general, you will end up seeing procs being valued higher than Bleeds, and DoTs.

Occasionally you will see the Single Target profile make an odd suggestion. The most notable was Condensed Life Force showing as the best Essence for a large number of people. In practice this is one of the worst choices in a Mythic+ environment due to its long cooldown and not easily being lined up with Avenging Wrath/Crusade causing additional uses to be lost through a real dungeon causing further devaluation.

TL;DR is that DungeonSlice is perfectly acceptable in most situations. Every sim has its positives and negatives. Overall, the Single Target and small pack focus of DungeonSlice will more appropriately model the standard PUG which tend to have more small scattered pulls rather than larger pulls in organized groups.

General

What do I run for XYZ affixes?

The same thing you always run. As mentioned above we do not change based on affixes.

Should I ever delay Wake of Ashes?

If you are at the tail end of a pack with a single mob left that will die shortly it can be beneficial to save Wake of Ashes for the next pull. If you're fighting multiple mobs that will die shortly and the next pull is a boss, it can also be beneficial to save Wake of Ashes for the boss.

When should I use Avenging Wrath/Crusade?

In most cases you want to use Avenging Wrath/Crusade as often as possible. You should ensure that when you do press Wings that the pack you are fighting will not die soon. You want to get maximum benefit from the window. If your current pull is not dangerous but your next pull is deadly you would want to delay Wings for the deadly pack. The same applies to if a Boss is the next pull. If your current pack will not last long or is extremely easy you should delay Wings for the Boss.